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imorris
imorris
1/21/2016 3:10:15 AM
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Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Nice job, Mari. OTT is certainly a puzzle for the telcos and one that is unlikely to come with an easy solution. It'll be interesting to see how experiences in the US differ from those in Europe in light of the contrasting moves that regional authorities have made in the area of net neutrality. Europe certainly seems to have taken less of a hard-line stance on this than the FCC.

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Mike Robuck
Mike Robuck
1/21/2016 9:55:00 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Not to generalize, but I think it also helps that the rights to stream video content are a little looser than what we deal with here in the US? The content owners want their piece of the pie and companiies like CBS want to control their content. Do content owners and programmers have their own TV Everywhere offerings that compete with service providers? 

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msilbey
msilbey
1/21/2016 11:55:50 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Thanks. The net neutrality issue is a tangled mess and will get dragged into the debate again and again. It'll be interesting if and when someone starts to test out the equivalent of sponsored data on fixed-line networks. As in, what if Netflix could avoid having its service count toward a user's home broadband data cap? Someone has to pay for it, obviously. But is there a T-Mobile Binge On-like strategy that's possible? Or will advertisers be willing to pay for the data usage in exchange for branding/advertising consideration? And how will all that play on the legal front?

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
1/22/2016 8:16:00 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
> "It'll be interesting if and when someone starts to test out the equivalent of sponsored data on fixed-line networks."

Uh. Except I hope the FCC doesn't allow the same kind of sponsored data experiments on fixed-line networks? I suppose it's possible with AT&T and Comcast testing out data caps for fixed broadband internet, but so far, those providers haven't made data caps a nation-wide consistent policy.

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Mike Robuck
Mike Robuck
1/21/2016 1:32:29 PM
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Cox
I agree Mari. The phone service debacle aside, CEO Esser, CTO Hart and the rest of Cox seem to be on point most of the time. 

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Mitch Wagner
Mitch Wagner
1/21/2016 5:27:23 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
What I'm not seeing in these carrier-sponsored OTT efforts is a reason why consumers would want to subscribe. What do the carrier-sponsored services have that Netflix, Amazon, Hulu, etc. ain't got?

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Mike Robuck
Mike Robuck
1/22/2016 10:45:00 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Mitch, It sure does seem as though the content is almost even across the board, and now we have original programming from the likes of Netflix. I still think sports is one area that consumers what more of. 

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Ariella
Ariella
1/22/2016 12:08:42 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Mike Some others agree and have paid premium prices for the rights to broadcast sports games. But things haven't been working out so well for ESPN in that regard. From  http://deadspin.com/espns-uncertain-future-is-already-here-1753901086


ESPN is hemorrhaging subscribers and money. In a November regulatory filing, the network revealed that it has lost seven million subscribers over the past two years. While every popular TV channel has lost subscribers, the losses for ESPN and ESPN2 are among of the highest in the industry—and the most costly. 

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ms.akkineni
ms.akkineni
1/22/2016 2:06:26 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Mitch:

Good question.

Sports could be one exception. But just that itself may not be a convincing reason to buy in consumers.

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
1/22/2016 8:12:57 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
The popularity of sports channels like ESPN makes TwitchTV and LetsPlay videos somewhat interesting... Will people watching other people playing video games become nearly as popular as NFL/NBA/MLB/NHL? I assume some of these video game playing channels have already overtaken US soccer audiences, but it'll be interesting to see a burst of new "channels" showing e-sports or other live action events.

400 channels and nothing good to watch... Kids of tomorrow will have it even worse: 4,000,000 channels and nothing worth binge-watching?

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Ariella
Ariella
1/23/2016 6:51:37 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
<400 channels and nothing good to watch... Kids of tomorrow will have it even worse: 4,000,000 channels and nothing worth binge-watching?>

@mhhf1ve Unfortunately, I think that's a fairly accurate forecast. I suppose it is possible to develolp a channel for each sport, and allow say, something like cheerleading to take star position rather than appearing as just a feature of football games. 

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/25/2016 9:13:40 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Ariella: I think there comes the point where reduced options from more basic cable packages begin to make sense -- if only to infuse some simplicity to one's life!

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Ariella
Ariella
1/25/2016 9:26:03 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Joe it's true. Studies have proven that there is such a thing as having too many choices.  I recall they wer with jam and found confirmation in the NY Times ran six years ago under the title Too Many Choices: A Problem That Can Paralyze:

There is a famous jam study (famous, at least, among those who research choice), that is often used to bolster this point. Sheena Iyengar, a professor of business at Columbia University and the author of "The Art of Choosing," (Twelve) to be published next month, conducted the study in 1995.

In a California gourmet market, Professor Iyengar and her research assistants set up a booth of samples of Wilkin & Sons jams. Every few hours, they switched from offering a selection of 24 jams to a group of six jams. On average, customers tasted two jams, regardless of the size of the assortment, and each one received a coupon good for $1 off one Wilkin & Sons jam.

Here's the interesting part. Sixty percent of customers were drawn to the large assortment, while only 40 percent stopped by the small one. But 30 percent of the people who had sampled from the small assortment decided to buy jam, while only 3 percent of those confronted with the two dozen jams purchased a jar.

That study "raised the hypothesis that the presence of choice might be appealing as a theory," Professor Iyengar said last year, "but in reality, people might find more and more choice to actually be debilitating."

Over the years, versions of the jam study have been conducted using all sorts of subjects, like chocolate and speed dating.

I suppose then that someone can do the same for channels.

 

 



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vnewman
vnewman
1/25/2016 2:24:13 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Ariella.  That's a great study and you make a great point.  "Paralysis by Analysis" is the term I like to use.  This is also the theory Costco subscribes to and it is discussed in depth on CNBC's The Costco Craze: Inside the Warehousing Giant.  They use ketchup as an example: They only carry a couple of brands to choose from otherwise they found people get overwhelmed with choices and end up buying nothing at all.

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Ariella
Ariella
1/25/2016 2:40:58 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@vnewman exactly! It comes down to all kinds of things. When you have just a handful of choices, it can be easier to make a decision than when you have 50. That's why when I took my daughter to a photographer for her yearbook picture, she only showed her the pictures three at a time rather than the whole bunch. She kept going down in bunches of three, always keeping on the choice of the previous batch with the next two until it was finally narrowed down to one choice. 

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ms.akkineni
ms.akkineni
1/25/2016 3:25:05 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Ariella, @vnewman:

Good analogy both of you.

'Analysis Paralysis' is the excat phrase which can considerably impact the end result. In my personal experience when i am given with too many choices, I often get into the same mode and end up settling with the best out of confusion. More options are good to the extent that we don't end up in that paralysis mode. Having choices is certainly better, but not too many to be overwhelmed with.

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
1/25/2016 6:55:15 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
I like the term "analysis paralysis"--at some stage a decision has to be made for sure.   We have to make a decision at some stage--Just to share with all, I have been running both Roku & Amazon--and I am experiencing bandwidth issues which I need to fix by probably upgrading my service.    I also think do also underscore that choice can be both "good" and "bad"--I tend to edge on the side of the positive because it is through that very fact that we can finally cross the "Chasm" and have the mass market appeal.   I hope all agree we see that already with the iOT. 

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vnewman
vnewman
1/26/2016 2:00:37 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@mpouraryan - Well, no decision is still a decision, it's just the decision not to take action.  :)  What I like to say is, "When in doubt, do nothing!"

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
1/26/2016 2:03:08 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
The Problem is that indecision is the "death Knell".    I am not that keen especially on service provider  as in my home county of Orange County, Cox elected not to extend service to a particular shopping center because "it was not profitable".    They need to figure out how to survive long-term.   There lies the challenge. 

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
1/26/2016 2:05:07 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
From a braoder leadership question, though, doing nothing cannot be an answer.   If Edison elected to do nothing, we won't have electricity; If Ford elected not to build the Model T, we won't talking about Driverless Cars; If Jobs did not have the vision for the GUI when the first Mac was created, we won't be where we are today...etc. etc. etc...   It is up to us to make sure that courage is maintained--right?  Or am I being simply naive? 

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/26/2016 6:40:18 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
In the case of the jam study Ariella cites, I suspect it's because people subconsciously devote x period of time to their "jam decision" or what-have-you (i.e., people only have so much patience for a single thing), and when that time period expires and a purchasing decision has yet to be made, no purchase is made at all.

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Ariella
Ariella
1/26/2016 6:44:17 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Joe I see about Netflix. For the jam, I really think it's about dealing with an overwhelming number of factors to consider rather than the time. If I'm dealing with just three, I can easily compare the price, ingredients, and nutritional info of each to the other. I'd ask myself: am I willing to pay more for more natural ingredients or less sugar and work off of that. But when you get a lot of varieties, you have multiple brands that would be pretty much the same in terms of both quality and price. That makes it hard to choose between them, and you end up with a more complex, human version of Buridan's ass.

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/26/2016 6:42:52 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
It's funny how people can apply terrific techniques in communicating with children and helping children make decisions -- but then throw everything out the window when dealing with adults.

I did a lot of study of child development in law school when I was researching interviewing and counseling techniques for child clients.  The literature indicates that the longer it takes someone to learn something/the later someone gets a skill in their life, the more difficult it is for them throughout their whole life.  For this reason, the simplest language should always be employed for effective communications (I'm sure I've violated that principle already in this comment).

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/26/2016 6:36:16 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
I would imagine that the choice problem is heightened at Costco because the volume of stuff you're buying there -- since you're buying in bulk -- probably creates a deeper and more looming sense of commitment.  "This is the ketchup I'm going to be stuck with for the next two years."

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/26/2016 6:34:32 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
It's the same for me with Netflix.  Back when Netflix actually recommended things to you based on, you know, things you actually might like, it was so much easier and more appealing.  Now?  I pretty much just use it to repeat-binge on things I've already seen as I fall asleep.

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Ariella
Ariella
1/26/2016 6:36:15 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Joe having a wild and crazy time, aren't' you? You think the algorithms got switched around?

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/26/2016 6:38:45 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Ariella: Nowadays, Netflix is less about telling you about stuff you might like and more about pushing certain programming (especially its original programming) on you -- making it more difficult to find content I'll like as I wade through all the stuff Netflix is trying to promote (I can't even sort through stuff I've already watched by rating I gave it anymore).

No, Netflix, I don't want to watch Aziz Ansari's new show or the latest hipster documentary or whatever the flavor of the month is now.

I might cancel.  Waste of money.

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
1/26/2016 11:06:44 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Netflix has totally abandoned its ratings/recommendations systems. Remember when they had the $1MM prize to help improve its recommendation system? Did they actually implement it? Nope. The recommendation system didn't translate into more loyal subscribers. 

Netflix also killed its "social network" experiment too... 

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/29/2016 9:16:50 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
To be fair, much of Netflix's original programming (at least, in the beginning) was based upon  user-preference insights.  But it may have somehow along the way gone from taking pains to find out what customers want and providing it to simply telling customers what they want.

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
1/22/2016 8:08:19 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
I think some of these carrier services are trying to test the waters of offering exclusive content just like Netflix/Hulu/Amazon/etc. Except no one has ever heard of some of the new content (and likely never will) -- just like no one really talks about Hulu's attempts to do a "Talk Soup" knock-off discussing TV shows in a format that summarizes a bunch of reality TV shows so you don't actually have to watch the original shows.

There is an amazing amount of content being produced now in this "golden age" of streaming video, but it's also insanely difficult to get a large audience to watch any particular show. Nielsen ratings are not what they used to be.... 

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Mitch Wagner
Mitch Wagner
1/26/2016 11:15:32 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
mhhf1ve - Creating compelling content requires skill and money in areas that service providers often lack expertise. 

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vnewman
vnewman
1/26/2016 1:45:37 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
True, and correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't METV merely like a aggregate or search engine for content that was already out there?

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
1/26/2016 2:17:58 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
As I am sure you agree @mitch, many of the service providers have what I'd like to call "outsource" their content requirements.    AT&T & Yahoo is just one example.    I frankly think it will be a great fit for AT&T To eat up Yahoo to get the further footprint, get the original content (since Yahoo does do some good work). 

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
1/26/2016 3:02:17 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
>  "I frankly think it will be a great fit for AT&T To eat up Yahoo to get the further footprint, get the original content.." 

Hmm. Is Yahoo actually doing that well with its original content? 

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/yahoo-shuts-down-yahoo-screen-851946

Yahoo Screen is shutting down.... and it looks like they lost $42MM on the experiment. That's not too bad, actually. They could have lost a lot more... not sure how the $1B buy of Tumblr is doing....

 

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Mitch Wagner
Mitch Wagner
1/27/2016 1:36:16 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
There are rumors Verizon will buy Yahoo.

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
1/27/2016 1:37:36 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
It will be a good fit--which then means AT&T has to be on the hunt to build out its' own content. :)))

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Mitch Wagner
Mitch Wagner
1/28/2016 11:11:23 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Yes, Yahoo could complement Verizon's previous acquisition of AOL. 

Or it could be an anchor pulling Verizon down. Yahoo wasn't succeeding on its own -- why should we think it would succeed in combination with Verizon?

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
1/28/2016 1:01:28 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Shareholder "Value" just for the Alibaba AND Yahoo Japan may well be worth it--that's the way I see it since the valuation of the "core business" is at or near zero based on the estimates--The other issue is sheer "traffic"--still 200 Million+ (that's still quite a number that can be integrated).

 

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Mitch Wagner
Mitch Wagner
1/29/2016 10:22:00 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
mpouraryan - Yes, Yahoo Japan and Alibaba are the assets worth $$$. The rest of Yahoo has zero or negative value. 

As for traffic -- in the 90s, we saw companies selling eyeballs like that, but I don't know that's a valid business model today. Eyeballs roam too easily. 

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/30/2016 12:17:29 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Yahoo certainly does have the eyeballs.  I remember a study a few years ago indicating that Yahoo had the second-most ad impressions (after Facebook), and I wouldn't be surprised if that's still the case.

And there are certainly a lot of marketers out there who believe that impressions are everything.

These are what we call "bad marketers."

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
1/31/2016 2:37:32 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Agreed @Mitch--it is at the end about the quality of the content for sure and about how to monetize--but still the prospects of havin the 200 Mil visitors is enticing. :)) 

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
1/28/2016 3:06:46 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
> "Yahoo wasn't succeeding on its own -- why should we think it would succeed in combination with Verizon?"

Presumably, Yahoo without cranky shareholders and a totally new owner would be able to cut staff significantly and kill off a lot more dead weight products that Yahoo has collected. Also, I'd expect Yahoo's intellectual property to be sold off to a patent troll for a few billion (but maybe a patent protection program will save Yahoo's IP from the trolls).

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/29/2016 9:13:45 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@mhh: Of course, it's many of the cranky shareholders (i.e., the part-owners) who want to have that kind of overhaul.  The majority shareholders are standing in their way, alas.

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Mitch Wagner
Mitch Wagner
1/29/2016 10:20:36 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
I've seen speculation that the new Yahoo should be built with Tumblr as a foundation, with professional media companies using the Tumblr platform as a publishing platform, and Tumblr's large community for amplification. Keep Yahoo Business, Mail, Flickr, and whatever few other properties might be sucessful, sell or shut down the rest. 

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/30/2016 12:15:39 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Mitch: That's certainly what a lot of people thought when that news was announced -- but it seems like something in that direction would have happened by now.

Then there's the Summly acquisition that we all thought would make Yahoo search smarter and more competitive.  LOL.

Does Mayer know what she's doing?  Does she have a plan?  Seems to me like her hire was her being Peter-Principled and then some.

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Mitch Wagner
Mitch Wagner
2/1/2016 10:27:35 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Give Mayer credit: Yahoo would be in a lot worse shape without her than it is with her.

If she can make a tidy profit for investors by selling it off, entirely or in pieces, that will be considered a successful outcome for her CV. Eric Schmidt did something similar at Novell prior to getting hired at Google. 

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
2/2/2016 6:55:41 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
The earnings for Yahoo just came out--and it is not pretty---a 4.4 Billion Write-Down (basically writing down things like Tumblr, for instance)>    Yes although she's "stabilized" the ship, the core business appears not to be worth anything as the aftermarket pricing I was seeing reflects.  Let's see what tomorrow brings.     

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
2/2/2016 7:12:15 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@mpourayan: Indeed... "stablized" it to 2006-2007 levels, yes?

Except this time (I'd bet) no buyout offer from Microsoft will be forthcoming in the near future.

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
2/2/2016 7:35:57 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
It is tragic--no question.   It is just a matter of time before someone takes them out of their misery.    The 300 Mil+ visitors though should be worth something in terms of leverage.   Anyone in the startup virtual space (which I am working on) would love to have even a fraction of it..but maybe I'm daydreaming.....

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
2/2/2016 9:16:15 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
> "The 300 Mil+ visitors though should be worth something in terms of leverage."

I'm surprised that Yahoo has held on to its audience for so long. I wonder how many people still use the same old "Homepage" every day? Yahoo instant messenger was so dominant, not that long ago! It really shows how fragile Facebook's position actually is, and why FB keeps buying other social networks to extend its reign. 

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
2/3/2016 1:37:47 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
There is indeed a realization to that effect.

This underscores it @mhhhf1ve:

https://econsultancy.com/blog/67470-facebook-twitter-make-ux-changes-in-fight-to-stay-social/?utm_source=currently&utm_medium=browser-extension&utm_campaign=chrome

 

https://econsultancy.com/blog/67470-facebook-twitter-make-ux-changes-in-fight-to-stay-social/?utm_source=currently&utm_medium=browser-extension&utm_campaign=chrome

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
2/9/2016 1:11:51 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@mhh: Well, their content does have VERY good SEO (on, heh heh, Google).  Yahoo Answers  comes to mind.

Plus, the company once did such a good job of building community that many users have stayed with it -- despite its more recent lackluster-ness.

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
2/9/2016 2:10:31 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Is Yahoo Answers still that popular? I thought the stackexchange network and certain Reddit forums and maybe even Quora replaced Yahoo Answers as the place to go for online Q&A.

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
2/21/2016 11:44:00 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
I'm of the impression that the only people that still use Quora are the ones who were super-excited about it to begin with and continue to cling to it -- much as with G+.

Plus, you don't have to be signed up to Yahoo to see Yahoo Answers.  There's a lot of appeal there.  Quora doesn't really have much of a monetization model and never did.  Yahoo at least understands that views can lead to impressions which can lead to clickthroughs which can lead to conversions.

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
2/23/2016 12:22:37 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@mp: Hey, let's not forget that Instagram netted a cool 10 figures off of Facebook based on little more than user numbers!

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
2/23/2016 2:38:20 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Joe:  For sure--and the more I think about it, the more jealous I get.    I can't but wonder whether in fact they could have pulled it off now though. 

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batye
batye
3/6/2016 7:17:38 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@mpouraryan  same question... but time will tell...

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
2/20/2016 10:08:32 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
People were long predicting Tumblr would be a write-off.  I suppose the only surprise is that it took Yahoo this long to do so.

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
2/2/2016 7:09:34 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Mitch:

> Yahoo would be in a lot worse shape without her than it is with her.

With all due respect...

For the past year-plus, we've been seeing a market correction in Yahoo's valuation.  Her tenure at Yahoo seems to have been business-as-usual for the company: acqui-hire after acqui-hire.

Or am I missing something?  I fully allow for the fact that I may lack important information.




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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
2/2/2016 7:20:29 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
The most classic one was the 30-million acquisition of what that kid did in the UK......

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
2/21/2016 11:41:46 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
To be fair, that kid and his search solution were pretty darn impressive.  Too bad they're gone now -- lost in he black hole that is Yahoo.

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
2/21/2016 3:28:32 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Joe et. al:  Yahoo's demise is tragic--no question.  But I still would underscore the foundation that it does have that someone can take advantage of.    There are also openings for sure--for instance some of the media properties.    I will go out on a limp and suggest SoftBank may "scoop up" some of the properties as it is trying to do what it can to keep Sprint alive.    What is interesting is that Marissa Meyer has been excluded from the strategic alternatives being pursued.   

 

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
2/23/2016 12:26:52 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
To be fair, I'm not ready to call Yahoo's current circumstances a "demise."  The company still is one of the biggest in the valley -- even if its revenues have been flattish and its TAC has steadily risen.  It's not a failure yet.  It's just been in the slow, steady process of failing -- absent something phoenix-like.

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
2/23/2016 2:47:36 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
No question @Joe they are still a force to be reckoned with.    As this case study that Mike Outlined, though, underscores is this:  Transformation entails being able to make the tough calls constantly and not wait too long--they're seeing the light though as they've formed the committee to explore strategic options.    

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
2/23/2016 3:28:12 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Yahoo isn't exactly dead yet. A lot of other web properties would love to be in Yahoo's position with traffic and attention. It's just that Yahoo has had more negative than positive attention lately... and mostly focused on how its business is doing.

If Yahoo Screen had just one "hit show" or if Tumblr had taken off like Instagram... Yahoo would be in a very different place now, I think. If only Yahoo had at least ONE well-known property that was really hitting it out of the park... does it? Flurry doesn't count. 

It will be sad to see Yahoo Messenger bought and re-branded something else. (Yahoo-Verizon Messenger!)

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freehe
freehe
2/27/2016 2:53:49 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Cox is on the right path. Cox may have terminated the OTT service due to licensing conflicts with Comast X1. This is a silly question but shouldn't companies verify potential conflicts before they start testing a product?

They will keep trying until the get it right. Failure if just one step closer to success and since they don't have to answer to sharefolders they can fail as many times as they like. Thomas Edison failed at least 1,000 before becoming successful in inventing the light bulb.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/nathanfurr/2011/06/09/how-failure-taught-edison-to-repeatedly-innovate/#f27f20138f5b

 

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batye
batye
3/6/2016 7:15:59 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@freehe interesting to know... thanks for the link... also I would like to add Donald J. Trump his fourth time bankruptcy and now his is running for greatest chair in USA :) ... never give up... 

ps: I do not agree with Donald J. Trump points of view or his ideas/points... but I do admire the way he always lands on his feet and survive.... 

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batye
batye
3/6/2016 7:08:47 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@mhhf1ve yes, you are right Yahoo could still recover... as with IT field you never know... Apple did it... why not Yahoo...??? 

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
2/2/2016 9:13:56 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
> "Her tenure at Yahoo seems to have been business-as-usual for the company: acqui-hire after acqui-hire."

The acqui-hire trend continues at Yahoo because the really talented engineers wouldn't want to go to Yahoo's sinking ship. With an acqui-hire, Yahoo has a shot at convincing some of them that they could do something useful with Yahoo's resources.

Still, it doesn't look like there's been much long-term value created within Yahoo. Without its fortuitous investment in Alibaba, Yahoo would be really struggling. 

I think it's unfortunate that Yahoo couldn't create a Hulu clone with Yahoo Screen. But it's not easy to build a media empire with content... Yahoo has the eyeballs, tho, still... so it's worth something -- if someone knew what to do with it.

The other problem is that Yahoo has never really had a hardware product to go with its services, so it can't even claim to have much intellectual property in a device. 

I'm really surprised Yahoo was never able to replicate an auction site back in the day when eBay was still young, too. Heck, it might even still be able to try to replicate a Craigslist clone. 

Tumblr, tho.. that seems to be a repeat of a mistake. They already tried Geocities. And Mayer should have known from Blogger that Tumblr wasn't really worth $1B. I suppose she was trying to turn it into the next Snapchat/Twitter/Instagram or social media site, but I don't think it's really caught on the way it could have. And Yahoo doesn't even really do much analytics on Tumblr, if I'm not mistaken... 

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
2/9/2016 1:09:24 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@mhh: To be fair, I really believe that Tumblr could have "made it" with a complete overhaul of the business model (which has always been a laughable one).  It's a very clever and very flexible product/service, but you can't build a Silicon-Valley empire on a B2C model relying mostly on selling t-shirts and template designs.

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
2/23/2016 2:16:26 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Tumblr may not have been worth $1B by itself, but it may have been worth it to Mayer to keep it away from Google or another suitor -- one that would have the resources and know-how to properly wield Tumblr as a weapon to sieze yet more market share from Yahoo.

In any case, during that period Mayer was beating the "mobile" drum, and the acquistions reflected that -- particularly that of Summly.

Too bad they don't seem to have done much with them -- mobile-wise or otherwise.

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
2/23/2016 2:51:03 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Joe: They (Yahoo) just had its developer conference.  There was not much fanfare--however it seems as if they're continuing to push things along.  The question is whether it is enough or not.  

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
2/23/2016 3:22:36 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
> "Tumblr may not have been worth $1B by itself..."

Yahoo had some legitimate interest in trying to turn Tumblr into a mobile social media platform. Tumblr could have become another microblogging network comparable to Twitter and Instagram, and arguably, it HAS done better than G+ as a social media network.

The problem with Tumblr is that it's not capturing headlines as a social network with a particular niche. Sure, it's got a younger demographic... but it doesn't have an "easy to explain" kind of following. Twitter is for news junkies and activists. Tumblr... is... ??? 

Tumblr isn't dead yet, either... it hasn't monetized like Facebook... so it's sorta stuck in a Twitter-like position of trying out some ads and losing some users. It could turn around still. I think Tumblr doesn't launch too many new useful features quickly enough.. just like Twitter. 

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
2/2/2016 9:22:42 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
> Does Mayer know what she's doing?  Does she have a plan?  Seems to me like her hire was her being Peter-Principled and then some.

Her performance so far... does seem to indicate that she might've just been "lucky" at Google. Unlike Steve Jobs, who stumbled, but then struck gold again at Apple and Pixar. 

But, on the other hand, Yahoo is a unique and difficult problem to correct. It might not even HAVE a solution, no matter who was put in charge. The clock was ticking as soon as she got the CEO position... and there just wasn't a lot of time to do all that much. Perhaps she should have fired a LOT more people as soon as she got on board? And just focused on a few services that had revenue/profits -- and just poured money into R&D to develop the "next big thing" on an insane timeframe.

 

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
2/9/2016 1:15:42 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@mhh: Yup.  Google got really mega-good at one thing before it started doing a zillion things.  Yahoo lost its core competency when Google came on the scene, so how do you fix that?  Find something else to be super good at (or try to reclaim the search throne)?  Because trying to be the tech jack-of-all-trades when you don't have that singular thing that defines you to begin with is problematic.

A few years ago, Yahoo was going to be all about mobile.  Remember that?  But what have they done other than acquihires?  Nothing.  The company exists to sell ad revenue and spend money.

Maybe we're all looking at this all wrong.  Maybe Yahoo needs to simply embrace being the also-ran -- and strive to be the third-party leader in "economy" solutions.  (After all, people still drink RC Cola.)

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
2/9/2016 2:02:32 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
With the benefit of hindsight, I'd say that Yahoo probably should have focused on building and developing its scalable datacenters to create an another AWS competitor. Then they'd at least have something of long-term value rather than social media eyeballs which could wander away at almost any time. Tumblr to my knowledge could have been just the start of creating a series of scalable cloud services, but I'm not sure if the datacenters Yahoo uses for Tumblr or Flickr/etc could be re-sold like AWS for developers to build new services on top. Mayer focused on mobile but she may have missed the boat on cloud datacenters that support mobile app development.

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
2/9/2016 2:08:32 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Another huge problem with yahoo's portfolio of services is that they've effectively created a huge barrier for partnering with any other company. They can't partner with Amazon bc Amazon is competitive with Alibaba. They cant partner with Apple bc that would jeopardize Yahoo's existing search business. And Yahoo has to walk a fine line between Microsoft and Google for search tech.

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
2/21/2016 11:45:53 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@mhh: I'm not as doubtful as you are about Yahoo's abilitiy to develop partnerships because of conflicts of interest.  That kind of incest happens in the valley all the time.  Heck, "partner" companies sue each other all the time.

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/29/2016 9:14:48 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Mitch: Or, put in programming terms: True and False == False.  ;)

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/29/2016 9:17:42 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Ehhh... If Verizon really wants to build out its own content, it could do a LOT better than purchasing Yahoo.

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
1/31/2016 2:35:59 AM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
I don't disagree with you--but the question is do they want to?   Is it their core competency? 

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
2/2/2016 6:48:40 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@mpourayan: Core competency assumes they have any competency.

(I KID!  I KID!)

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
2/2/2016 6:57:14 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
Falling out of my chair in laughter @Joe..but on a more serious note, one cannot help but be "semi-shocked" at the tragedy unfolding though.   On a side note, interesting tidbit on how Comcast is about to go toe to toe with Google in the five cities it is targeting....

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
1/26/2016 2:57:34 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
> Creating compelling content requires skill and money...

For sure. Just look at Yahoo's attempts to get its online video content going... Community didn't really re-boot that well. Katie Couric is sorta doing okay, but not quite the "Gotcha Journalism" she's known for....

 

 

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/29/2016 9:12:30 AM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
To be fair, I'm not sure Yahoo is a good example of much of anything these days -- other than "how to squander success."

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Mike Robuck
Mike Robuck
1/22/2016 12:13:28 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
ESPN has been the most expensive channel for years as far as what it charges, so I'm not suprised it has bled out a bit. Is its streaming options cutting into traditional viewership? 

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Ariella
Ariella
1/22/2016 12:49:47 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Mike that's a good question. Can it be in effect cannibalizing itself?

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ms.akkineni
ms.akkineni
1/22/2016 2:14:28 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Mike, @Ariella:

Really interesting question. I am interested to know the answer.

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/22/2016 9:28:28 PM
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Author
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Ariella: I think it's more a case of chewing off the leg to get out of the bear trap before the hunter comes.  ESPN knows that it faces video competition from others (including pirated content), so it offers free/sponsored video so at least it can attract people to the "official" source and get revenue from sponsors that way.

Whether ESPN is doing well in that regard is another question.

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ms.akkineni
ms.akkineni
1/22/2016 2:13:23 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
@Mike:

Can't agree more with you about ESPN's pricing. Aagain it's just the demand for sport that is driving the whole thing. Can anyone deny that consumers (most of us) here are a bit obsessive about sports?

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Joe Stanganelli
Joe Stanganelli
1/22/2016 9:29:55 PM
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Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
People are so passionate about sports that they get into violent, all-out brawls over their sports teams.  It doesn't take a genius to know, therefore, to charge more for sports content.  ;)

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
1/25/2016 6:45:28 PM
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Platinum
Re: Contrasting experiences in US and Europe
As someone who is part of the "cord cutting" crowd, I am quite happy w/my Amazon FireTV.    Ariella underscored how "too many choices" may end up truly confusing folks.   However, what is clear is that in the Transformation we're witnessing, it is frankly fun--but the question is one of bandwith before one even worries about Sports and as Joe put it, the "excitement" that it entails. 

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wilson@lightreading.com
wilson@lightreading.com
1/21/2016 10:57:33 AM
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Fast Failure?
IN a broader context, the fact that Cox made a quick pivot on its OTT strategy may actually be a positive sign. Legacy cable/telco companies aren't known for being willing to pull the plug quickly on services for strategic or market reasons, so Cox's action is actually pretty bold. It's probably easier to do that at a private company than one which is publicly traded, but still...

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msilbey
msilbey
1/21/2016 11:56:50 AM
User Rank
Gold
Re: Fast Failure?
I agree on the fast failure front, but I'm guessing this has less to do with the service failing (it didn't have time to fail, though I belive it would have), and more about Cox's relationshiop with Comcast and the X1 licensing deal. That's pure speculation, mind you, but it makes logical sense.

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dlr5288
dlr5288
2/22/2016 2:44:16 PM
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Platinum
Re: Fast Failure?
I also think that Cox cut the cord too quick. I think they were realizing that it was going to be a failure and didn't want to pour any more money into it. I think the thing that really killed this service was the competitors. I know that Comcast has a similar feature.

New ideas and sometimes new technologies put people off because they don't like chnage or are happy with what service they are already paying for. It would have been interesting to see if it actually would have been a failure. Personally, I think they may have given up a little too quickly.

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vnewman
vnewman
2/22/2016 3:15:50 PM
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Platinum
Re: Fast Failure?
@dlr5288 - I would tend to agree with you.  I think we will see another telco go down the same road with some success - perhaps after some retooling.  I just don't think Cox knew how to capitalize on what they had in front of them.

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
2/9/2016 2:14:08 PM
User Rank
Platinum
Telco and Yahoo are in similar boats.
And just so no one thinks Yahoo discussions are completely off topic here -- telcos are facing similar problems of finding new services to launch without cannibalizing existing businesses. Telcos and MSOs are going to need to "transform" just like Yahoo needed to... And hopefully, they'll do a better job of it.

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mpouraryan
mpouraryan
2/21/2016 12:24:26 AM
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Platinum
Re: Telco and Yahoo are in similar boats.
@mhhf1ve & @Joe: The "convergence" is there--anyone who doubts it is doing so at their peril.  Yes Yahoo does have some major traffic that goes to it that could make it attractive for anyone that's thinking more broadly.    It will be interesting to see which of the Telcos' will in fact pick it up.    

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mhhf1ve
mhhf1ve
2/21/2016 1:18:26 AM
User Rank
Platinum
Re: Telco and Yahoo are in similar boats.
@mpouraryan Yahoo is indeed up for sale now, so it may very well be a telco that will pick it up. I'm not sure any other companies with deep pockets have any interest in Yahoo's "core business" but maybe there's a private equity group that thinks it can sell off the parts more effectively. Or a patent troll? 

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Itsmeshawn22
Itsmeshawn22
3/31/2017 11:49:21 PM
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Platinum
Cox Kicks OTT Service to the Curb
This is very interesting because noone never seen this coming but like everyone is saying time will tell to see how this all works out in the long run. THis is also very shocking because the OTT is very sucessful with the systems they produces.

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